Creating Accountability and Safety at Work

In this episode, I sit down with Dr Enya Doyle, also known as The Harassment Doctor, to discuss the critical role of accountability and psychological safety in the workplace. 

Dr Doyle shares her expert insights on recognising harassment, fostering a culture of transparency, and implementing practical strategies for safer, more inclusive work environments.

Key Topics Covered:

✅ Understanding Workplace Harassment: The most common types of misconduct and subtle behaviours organisations often overlook.
✅ Real-Life Examples: Powerful stories of how accountability and intervention have transformed workplaces.
✅ Defining Accountability & Safety: What these terms mean in practice and why they are crucial for organisational success.
✅ Practical Strategies for Leaders: Steps organisations can take to encourage transparency, prevent harassment, and build a culture of trust.
✅ Quick Wins for Listeners: Immediate actions anyone can take to improve workplace safety and accountability.

Key Takeaways:

🔹 Psychological safety is the foundation of true accountability.
🔹 Proactive leadership is essential for fostering a culture of trust.
🔹 Simple policies and open conversations can make a big impact.

Final Thoughts:

Dr Doyle shares actionable advice for managers and employees, ensuring they leave with practical steps to create safer, more accountable workplaces.

Transcript

Andrea Derbyshire (00:10)
Hello everyone and welcome to the Inclusive Edge, the Power of Diversity podcast. I'm your host Andrea Derbyshire and we're here to explore all things related to creating equitable, inclusive and thriving workplaces. In today's episode we're going to focus on creating accountability and safety at work and I'm being joined today by a wonderful guest Dr. Enya Doyle who's widely known as the harassment doctor.

Dr Doyle specialises in workplace harassment prevention and organisational culture transformation and we're going to be discussing some real life examples, key strategies and top tips that hopefully you can take back and implement in your own teams. So thank you for joining us today Dr Doyle. Could you share a little bit about your background and what led you to focus on workplace harassment and safety for the listeners please?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (00:59)
Sure, thank you for having me and hi everyone. I am Dr. Enya Doyle, the harassment doctor. I got into this via my PhD. I think it's the easiest way to kind of give the backstory. So I did a doctorate on barriers to gender equity in classical music, which I finished at the start of the pandemic in 2020. It was a fun time for everyone. And so that PhD obviously

Andrea Derbyshire (01:13)
Yeah.

Thank

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (01:27)
did a lot of research, I spent a lot of time with people who had had really difficult journeys, but also people who were trying to do the best that they could with histories and traditions and institutions that were very slow moving. So thinking about how those systems played out and what went wrong, what they were creating, what those barriers were and how they impacted on people. When I finished my PhD,

I was like, I'm going to just keep doing this. I was doing a lot of advisory work through my doctorate anyway. So I continued to consult for some of those institutions and organizations. And then it just kind of grew from there. But always keeping the focus on the people who were being impacted.

Andrea Derbyshire (02:02)
Yep.

Yeah and what is your career background, Dr Doyle, before you became the harassment doctor? Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (02:19)
So yeah,

so that's it really. I'm very young. So I went from my undergrad to my master's to my PhD and that's been it. But I am a musician, obviously. Music is the place that I feel safest, which is obviously something we're going to be talking about today. But I've spent a lot of time with clients in the music industry and in the arts. But I've obviously and

Andrea Derbyshire (02:35)
Amazing.

Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (02:44)
you're more than welcome to work with me irrespective of what industry you're in. yeah, it's been academia to the real world and back I still work with quite a lot of higher education clients.

Andrea Derbyshire (02:56)
Yeah, so it's a lot of academia and education that you work on a consultancy basis doing that work. Yeah, brilliant. That's fascinating to hear. Thank you for sharing that. So I'm sure in the work that you've been doing that you've encountered and come across a broad range of different types of workplace issues. So everything from overt harassment to some subtle and more systemic problems.

Could you give us a bit of an overview of the types of harassment or unsafe behaviours that you've come across and that you see in organisations and how they kind of typically manifest in your experience?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (03:34)
Yeah, for sure. think

one of the things that I would say from the off is harassment feels like a really big and ugly and dirty kind of word. It feels very serious, but it's an everyday occurrence for lots of people. And I think that's where I would start is that harassment feels like the kind of unwanted cousin of inclusion, but it is an everyday reality. And I say that because

Andrea Derbyshire (03:43)
Yeah.

Yeah.

you

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (03:57)
It is largely and in definition in the UK and further afield, it includes things like jokes and banter gone wrong or comments. Largely, harassment is not physical, which is another thing that I spent an awful lot of my time saying, is that there is a difference between harassment and other forms of sexual violence or discrimination that becomes nonverbal.

Andrea Derbyshire (04:13)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (04:21)
harassment is usually verbal and it can be jokes. It's not just cat calls and wolf whistles. It's not just very overt, harmful language that's intended and very clearly intended to cause harm. But there's definitely, there's definitely a lot of jokes in the workplace that people don't realise are not just ill-advised, but actually illegal.

Andrea Derbyshire (04:35)
Yeah.

Yeah, do you think that's a common misconception and that people think that sexual harassment is all around physical contact in your experience?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (04:51)
Hmm, yeah, for sure.

Absolutely. Which also, you know, in the harassment part is in the Equality Act. And there are other acts like the Sexual Offences Act, which includes sexual assault, assault by penetration and rape. And again, those are three different things, but people tend to talk about sexual harassment through to rape as one kind of entity. And I think when people find out that they are very different things.

People can have some very horrible realizations. I've had a couple of clients who themselves, people, business partners, directors of inclusion, who in talking to me have been like, okay, I've just realized something about my life or about my child's life or about my friend's relationship. I'm like, yes, it is very common for us to have realizations when we stop minimizing the impact of this.

Andrea Derbyshire (05:47)
Yeah, I recall a few months ago I shared an experience that I had early in my career on LinkedIn where a manager pinged my bra strap in a training meeting and I thought that was sexual harassment. I think you commented at the time that because they did that, was actually sexual violence. Yeah. Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (05:53)
Hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah, it's actually sexual assault or likely to be sexual assault. Yeah. And that's

the thing. you know, there are, there are lots of places, there lots of examples, even now in 2025, there are kind of promotional materials that are being put up for very positive reasons. It's really good that we're talking about this as a society, but that are getting the definition wrong and sharing, you know, there are various forms of malicious misinformation happening in society today.

Andrea Derbyshire (06:24)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (06:33)
But there are also forms where people just don't have the right information and we're sharing the wrong information. are plenty of organisations including the Human Rights Commissions that are sharing information that is incorrect or that isn't fully correct. And then people are going off, obviously thinking that's a trusted source. I'm going to carry on with my understanding and that can have loads of different negative.

consequences.

Andrea Derbyshire (06:58)
Yeah, absolutely. Thank you. So I'd love to hear from yourself about some real life examples, either from clients that you've worked with or things that you've observed of how harassment and a lack of safety or accountability, how that plays out in the workplace and then also how those situations can be resolved. Is there a couple of examples that you could share with us today?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (07:20)
think there are obviously there are lots of examples in the press as of recent examples like Greg Wallace and Mohammed Al Fayed come to mind as very recent examples. And I have said to my clients during that period of time that there are examples like that happening everywhere. And there are people who are kind of misusing their power in all organizations. And so

Andrea Derbyshire (07:29)
Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (07:44)
I certainly have worked and done investigations and done kind of almost postmortems of situations where senior leaders are using and misusing their power. And some of that is really overt and that is they are actually either assaulting more junior colleagues or sexually harassing more junior colleagues. But there's also a kind of covert version of this, which is happening in most organisations.

Andrea Derbyshire (07:57)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (08:10)
which is that they're just allowing it to go unspoken. So the cultures of silence in lots of organizations is one of the main things that I spend my life working on with my clients, whether that's finding that through audits or whether that's when I'm working with them on retainer is looking at that culture of silence, why people aren't speaking up, where reports aren't happening or why people are withdrawing reports.

And looking at power imbalances and how that tends to play out. But I would say some very clear signs, themes that we see all the time are the kind of whys of silence. Like why is this not being reported? And when it is being reported, what is actually happening to that information? Because that is where power starts to become misused and where the avenue towards people.

Andrea Derbyshire (08:35)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (09:00)
like Greg Wallace and Mohammed Al-Fayed being reported for abusing their power, it didn't start there. It started with the silence.

Andrea Derbyshire (09:08)
Yeah and how do you do that? What methodologies do you use to look into those issues to get an understanding of the silence in the organisation?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (09:18)
I think the main thing I spent an awful lot of my time talking to people about it being over complicated. And a lot of people don't have time to make it more complicated than it is. I would say the first thing is to actually look at your people and to listen to the people that you've gone and use the information that you already have. There are loads of

Andrea Derbyshire (09:27)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (09:45)
really complex and convoluted ways to look at this. There are loads of really high academic articles on silence. There are lots of amazing researchers who are researching cultures of silence. And some of my clients were kind of bookworms and they want to read books by Sarah Ahmed and that sort of thing. thinking about the people that you have, thinking about the data that you already have and then working backwards with the information that you've got to look at.

you know, when people drop out of investigations, what people are saying informally about the HR processes, about their understandings, their expectations, their assumptions, the myths that they hold, largely their expectations on the one hand are based on a kind of false preconception of what's going to happen.

But then there are other examples in lots of organisations where people have been victimised and people have been sacked and people have been treated really horribly for reporting and although it is illegal, so is sexual harassment and people still do it.

Andrea Derbyshire (10:33)
Yeah.

Yeah, I still think that there is a fear of people speaking up and people they'll often leave the organization rather than put their head above the parapet and challenge which... Okay, have you got an example of an incident where leadership have struggled to address what's been reported to them in an effective way?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (10:58)
Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely. think one of a client I worked with early last year, I spoke really early on with the CEO, which is a key part of the work that I do is that I usually get contacted by a director of human resources, people director or a director of inclusion or something similar. And I'll often say to them, I need to speak to your CEO. I spoke to the CEO and said, you know, what's, what's your perspective on this?

Andrea Derbyshire (11:20)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (11:37)
And he said to me, was like, just feel, I feel like I've put so much energy into creating a values driven business, but the values aren't being played out. And he was getting kind of defensive. And I said to him, like, it's okay for you to defend the values that you've created so long to kind of implement and that you really stand by the values and you really stand by your product and you really stand by.

the clients that you work with and how you choose them and X, Y, Z. But the fear of reputational damage, the fear of your values being underwritten isn't going to change the fact that people are doing this in your organization. This is happening with those values there anyway. So there's a lot of, I see a lot of defensiveness that isn't, that didn't happen, but can often play out as though it feels as though they're saying that didn't happen or that wouldn't happen here.

Andrea Derbyshire (12:19)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (12:30)
which people do say. But in that particular example, you know, we talked about the common things like, is this a PR exercise? Are we trying to avoid you being in the press? Is this a compliance thing where you're trying to be compliant plus? And for him, it was very much a, want to do the right thing, but also I thought I was doing the right thing and now I feel really defensive about.

Andrea Derbyshire (12:31)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (12:58)
my company and what you're saying about my company and what you're saying about the people that I trust and who are really good at their jobs and who I want to protect because they've worked for me for 25 years or they've worked for me for however long. So often what happens and what happened in that particular organisation is a kind of rush to justify or explain away.

behaviors because well it couldn't happen here because these are our values and we spent so much time and we've invested so much money into this and we spend so much time talking about our values and we hire on our values and you know everyone knows our values and in reality people can you know decent people do make mistakes and people decent people do things that are wrong for loads of different reasons that doesn't mean that your institution is is completely flawed but

Andrea Derbyshire (13:44)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (13:51)
the defensiveness isn't going to help you find a solution for the people who are hurt.

Andrea Derbyshire (13:56)
And how did you turn that around with that organization?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (14:00)
I think a lot of the time it's about patience. The three kind of aspects of my company, things that I spend most of my time talking about are thinking about accountability, taking accountability for what's happened, taking accountability for what's going to happen, being curious about how that happened, so encouraging them to think about how it happened and curious about how it could happen again. So where it's likely to happen.

in the future where we already know the patterns, we've already identified the places where our employees are most at risk. So again, enough to think about that. And then the final bit is about decency is those values haven't gone away just because somebody decided to break away from those values, decided to break the law, decided to make your colleagues feel X, and Z. So thinking about bringing decency back into it, getting that allyship.

Andrea Derbyshire (14:37)
Yeah.

here.

.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (14:58)
around getting everyone to buy in. So getting it from the top, obviously having the CEO, having HR, having the rest of the senior leadership team on board, and then them modeling all of these conversations the whole way down and the whole way across. And it takes time. I think it's important that a lot of companies expect this to go away quietly and quickly.

But if it's done right and in that scenario, know, that work is still ongoing. They're in a significantly better place than they were. The trust that they have, the kind of openness of communication, their reporting systems and structures are significantly better than they were. But they know that it's an ongoing process. And when you hire a new person, you have to start again with that new person. But the accountability, curiosity.

Andrea Derbyshire (15:40)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (15:50)
and then going back to the fundamentals of decency.

Andrea Derbyshire (15:54)
Ian, thank you. So mentioned there when you were talking a number of different actions and things that have been implemented in that organisation, but which do you think, which changes make the greatest difference in being able to resolve tension and restoring trust when there's a sexual harassment case in an organisation? So it could be something big or something small, but what do you think has the greatest impact?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (16:19)
Yeah.

I think, I think transparency and in accountability is really important. Being transparent about the things that you can't change. The things that, that you wish that you could change, being really open and honest. Vulnerability is, is kind of part of that, but being really transparent about what you can and can't do. A lot of companies that I work with tend to come to me.

Andrea Derbyshire (16:27)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (16:46)
Kind of when it's too late, when they've already, they've already kind of sent out the bare minimum statement and it's not landed well. And their employees are like, what is going on here? This is corporate jargon and it's naff and it doesn't actually say nowhere is the phrase. I'm sorry, we're sorry, that shouldn't have happened. We're taking action. I think apologizing is probably, I think apologizing is probably one of the biggest.

Andrea Derbyshire (16:55)
Yeah.

Yeah, it's like a bonus.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (17:16)
parts of it that often goes unsaid and undone. I think apologizing, if more CEOs and more senior leaders apologized, then there will be a lot less tension in companies where this does happen. Because you can't responsibility for adults all of the time. You can't hand hold them everywhere. You can't check every single one of their behaviors.

Andrea Derbyshire (17:16)
Mm-hmm.

No.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (17:40)
You can take accountability and apologizing is the best and biggest step that you can take in terms of step one.

Andrea Derbyshire (17:46)
Yeah, absolutely. In my experience in working in HR and grievances and when you ask people what would they would like as an outcome of the process, often they do just want an apology and acceptance that they've been wronged and some form of restorative justice. So that definitely resonates with me. Can we move on now and talk a little bit about accountability and safety and define that impractical

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (17:54)
Mm.

Yeah.

Andrea Derbyshire (18:13)
everyday terms because those words can mean different things to people in different contexts. Could you explain for the listeners accountability and why psychological safety is so critical in fostering that sense of accountability?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (18:27)
Yeah, so I think you're right, accountability does mean different things to different people. And there are two, the two forms of it. In, in what you were just saying about grievances, there's the kind of interpersonal accountability, which is that in lots of these circumstances, it is an employee and another employee and

there's that interpersonal responsibility of I did that thing to you and I recognize the impact irrespective of my intent. So there's that part of the accountability. There's also a secondary accountability, which is institutional accountability. And the thing that I would say about accountability if you're thinking about it in the context of

Andrea Derbyshire (18:56)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (19:12)
maybe a first time manager or someone who's just taking responsibility for people is that accountability is about owning everything. It's about owning the successes and also the failures of your team. Accountability happens in the expectations that you set. There's a kind of preventative expectations and then the expectations after the fact. Accountability can include things like modeling good behavior.

and also in terms of the swiftness of your actions. So the accountability part for lots of companies is, you know, did you sit on that grievance? Did you stall it? Did you stall the process? Did you make the process unnecessarily difficult? The one thing that often the myth around accountability is that it's about blaming someone.

or cancel culture is a very common kind of part of what accountability looks like. No kind of vigilante justice. Social media has brought us into a kind of era of vigilante justice that I don't think anyone could have predicted. It's not about like ostracizing someone to the extent that they have no life or, you know, no hope. But it is about that kind of collective justice. It is about a collective outcome. It is about

Andrea Derbyshire (20:20)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (20:26)
education and them learning why that wasn't the right thing to do and them accepting that it wasn't the right thing to do and their being, you've used the phrase restorative justice, but thinking about that restoration of trust, that restoration of relationship. Because ultimately the accountability is that interpersonal and also the institutional, but it's not just the two or more people that were involved in the incident.

Andrea Derbyshire (20:42)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (20:53)
who need it. The team also needs that trust rebuilt and the company probably also are looking on thinking if that's how they're going to handle that then that's how I'll be treated too which connects to psychological safety in the company.

Andrea Derbyshire (20:54)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, you mentioned about intention, so that's something that when I do training on bullying and harassment that when you're investigating a grievance or a complaint, it's about how it made that person feel rather than whether they intended to offend or hurt that person. Is there anything that you can say around that that you can add around intention?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (21:16)
Mm.

Mm.

Yeah, I think

we often when we apologize, say, I'm really sorry, I didn't mean to hurt you. And that kind of becomes an excuse of like, I'm not a bad person. And I think that's why it's really important that we don't talk about or that we do talk about blame, but that we know that it's not, it's not the point of accountability is that you can not intend to hurt me and that still be the outcome. And if you say in your apology, I'm really sorry, I didn't mean to hurt you.

Andrea Derbyshire (21:52)
Yeah, yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (22:02)
you're kind of distancing yourself from the fact that I'm hurting. So legally in the Equality Act, there's intent and impact and you don't have to have both, you can have either. And I think that's important for people to know is that you cannot intend to cause harm and you can still cause harm, but also you can intend to cause harm and someone not perceive it as harm. think one of the key examples of that is catcalling.

Andrea Derbyshire (22:11)
it.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (22:28)
There has been lots of research around catcalling, which for many people would be considered sexual harassment. But there are also people who have said in lots of research and in polls that they find it flattering. But there could be other people in that same space that be like, was harassment, that was intended to create a hostile environment, that was intended to make you feel small. But for some people, if it's not received.

Andrea Derbyshire (22:46)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (22:53)
So even if you intend to cause harm and the impact isn't harm, then that's also still harassment.

Andrea Derbyshire (22:57)
Yeah.

Thank you for explaining that, think they're really important points. And how does psychological safety underpin accountability in your view?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (23:09)
I think where people aren't safe to report, it creates a leak. It creates a really big dearth in our communities where we feel that we can't speak up. So we know that it's happening in loads of organisations, but there's a kind of fear or there's an embarrassment or there's a kind of expectation of punishment of being punished for saying it.

in lots of companies, the psychological safety is kind of reduced because of how much time you're to have to spend with HR and investigations and I'm not going to be able to do my work or I'm going to be pulled out of an important meeting in order to have a restorative conversation with a colleague that I really don't want to spend any more time with. So I think psychological safety has been bandied around as a phrase that that much like

the acronyms that we use in inclusion have kind of come to mean something that they don't, but psychological safety is so important in terms of how we navigate the space. And also in terms of if you're listening to this and thinking about what you want to do in your companies, thinking about how people are given the opportunity to learn, take in information and also how they're given opportunities to report. Not everyone wants to walk into HR.

Andrea Derbyshire (24:20)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (24:31)
and say this happened to me. So psychological safety is also about, you know, anonymous reporting and anonymous opportunities for feedback and stuff like that.

Andrea Derbyshire (24:40)
Yeah, I think that's really important to have those reporting mechanisms in play. Many of the listeners of the podcast, they are diversity and inclusion leaders or they're people leaders and they are working and striving towards developing an inclusive environment. So what concrete steps would you recommend that organizations take to start to weave accountability and safety into their culture? So could be particular policies or frameworks or specific leadership behaviors. What would you

recommend.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (25:10)
I think the first

thing that I'd recommend is separating the work that you do on this out into prevention and also management. When I work with companies, they've either got one or the other. So the Worker Persection Act means that lots of companies now are working on the prevention piece of we're trying to make sure that it doesn't happen. And that's amazing and brilliant. lots of training is happening and has been happening and of tail end of 24 into early 25. But I would separate out.

Andrea Derbyshire (25:19)
Yes.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (25:40)
although they are obviously interconnected. Think about separating out the prevention bit and the response bit so that you're dealing with both properly and you're thinking about the policies and importantly when it comes to your policies, thinking about it from the perspective of someone reporting and someone being reported. Is your policy intended for those people or is it intended for your HR team to go through it?

Andrea Derbyshire (25:47)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (26:05)
What's the audience for those policies? Then you're looking at training, you're looking at leadership training. I think that one of the often overlooked parts of this is training your board and having your board engaging on this because if we go back to accountability, who's holding your company accountable if your board can't mark your homework because they don't have the information in order to do that. And then looking again at your reporting mechanisms, are they actually fit for purpose?

Andrea Derbyshire (26:22)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (26:32)
to people use them. If they don't use them, that's a very clear indication that they're not fit for purpose rather than that it's not happening in your company. Looking at things like anonymous and confidential reporting, whistleblowing policies and stuff like that. But definitely separating them out and then asking questions from the perspective of the people on the receiving end of them, as well as the people that have to actually do the investigation process.

Andrea Derbyshire (26:51)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, and we talked about organisational values and not everyone in the organisation live in the values. Is there any specific leadership behaviours that you think helps to set the tone for a safe, accountable organisational culture?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (27:17)
I think leaders that listen will be key to this. If you're a leader that listens across your company, then you will be modelling the right behaviour. think if you don't know what's happening on the ground in your company, then you're never going to get this right.

Andrea Derbyshire (27:33)
Yeah, yeah. And we know that organizations come in all different shapes and sizes and they have different budgets. So how do you think organizations with smaller teams, how can they implement these things quickly and effectively?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (27:47)
I think I've done quite a lot of advisory work for startups in recent years and fast growing teams, fast encounter issues then they never would have seen. But I would say the things that remain true in companies of all sizes are that it's about the people that you've got.

Andrea Derbyshire (27:49)
you

Okay, fantastic.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (28:08)
and the people that you have in your company are the ones worth listening to. There are loads of opportunities for getting best practice in what's worked in different industries or what works in massive companies or what works in the US. But making sure that it actually works in your company. Don't worry about your competitors as long as you're keeping your people safe.

Andrea Derbyshire (28:28)
Yeah, thank you. So if any of our listeners, if they want to do something at start right now, right this day, this week, what are your top tips? Any quick wins that organizations can implement? I know it needs to be an ongoing process, et cetera, but is there anything that they could take away and implement ASAP?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (28:48)
Yeah, I think the quickest thing to do is to look at your policy. you're in charge of your policy, to look at your policy, either with an employee resource group, if you've got one, or just with your team, and have a look at it and think about how it would feel to report using that system. And then take out the things that are kind of surplus to requirements, add in the things that you would need to know about the process.

from the perspective of someone that's being reported or that is reporting. That actually, when you look at it from that perspective, can be quite quick. You can kind of make very easy adjustments to that in under an hour and it can really change people's perspective. And on that, your policy is irrelevant if people don't know that it exists or where to find it.

Andrea Derbyshire (29:27)
Yeah.

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (29:35)
So make sure that people know that it exists. That's as simple as an email. That's as simple as making sure that people know if you've got offices and intranets, making sure that the policies are easily accessible to people. Because a lot of the time, even if you do have the best policy in the world, and you may well do, if your colleagues don't know that it exists, you may as well not have one.

Andrea Derbyshire (29:55)
Mm-hmm.

I totally agree, there's no point of it just sitting on a shelf in the HR department and no one being familiar with the content. Thank you so much for sharing your expertise and insights with us today Dr Doyle. It's been really great to hear your experiences and your recommendations. If our listeners want to learn more about you or get in touch, where can they find you?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (30:20)
So you can find me on LinkedIn, Dr. Enyad Oil and on Instagram at The Harassment Doctor. My website is EnyadOil.com. You'll find lots more about me and what I do there, but LinkedIn and Instagram, you can also find links to my mailing list in both of those places.

Andrea Derbyshire (30:39)
Thank you. Are there any closing comments or points that you want to share with the listeners?

Dr Enya Doyle (she/her) (30:44)
I think the one thing that I would say is that it feels really scary, but it doesn't have to be. And if you are feeling intimidated or scared or out of your depth, then the best thing that I can do is just suggest that you get help. I'm happy to have a free conversation with you. It doesn't have to be filled with money. If you're filled with fear, if you feel intimidated, if you want to do the right thing, but you're not sure what to do next, then just message me and I'd be happy to help you.

Andrea Derbyshire (30:49)
you

Amazing. Thank you so much Dr Doyle. So there's a great offer there from Dr Doyle for anyone who's seeking advice or support around how to manage and tackle these issues in the workplace. So to everyone tuning in today, I hope that you found today's conversation helpful. If you enjoyed the podcast, please subscribe or leave us a like. remember until next time, keep championing inclusivity, stay accountable and create safe spaces where

Everyone can flourish. Take care and we'll see you in the next episode.